Othello and Paradise Lost

One quote which I really agreed with was "Othello's hell is to contemplate the result of his own hideous perversity, and ours is to see ourselves in him." This quote came from a book titled Motiveless Malignity. I really like this quote because o the last part. While we were reading and discussing Othello, whether it was the first time or third time, almost everyone in the class was speculating about if they would have been tricked. Because of Iago's methods, I think we all would have. Yes, perhaps Othello got mad a bit too fast, but in the long run the result of Desdemona's death would have been the same. Iago was that good at being a master puppeteer for the other characters in the play.
Iago manipulates all the other characters in the same way Satan does. Beezlebub is Satan's Roderigo at this point in PAradise Lost. I am really enjoying how all the material we have covered is becoming more and more connected.

Paradise Lost

I am really enjoying Paradise Lost. The plot twist today was the last thing I expected, and I loved it! I can't wait to find out more about Satan's children that he never knew existed. I really want to know who the mother is!!!! I can't wait to find out.

The four plans

I have confusion about the plans.  I know Moloch wants to fight in another open war because he would rather die than lose, and Belial wants to do nothing because he thinks that he can get use to living in Hell.  I think that what Mammon wants to do is build a kingdom in Hell that they can call their own.  I don't get why that is greedy; it just seems like another Idea.  What really confused be is when Beezulbub started talking. He mocked Mammon for wanting to separate them selves from heaven, but Satan and Beelzubub don't want to associate with heavn, and they want to build a kingdom in hell just like Mammon wanted.  

Angel Edline Sheet

All I really know about Angels are stereotypes, and random things in the City of Bones book series. I am definitely familiar with some of the terms mentioned in the handout, such as Seraphim, Cherubim, and some of the Magnificent 7, like Raphael, and Sariel. In the City of Bones, the swords of shadow hunters are named after angels, so that's pretty cool. At the end of the sheet it says that a scholar noted the angel count to be above 304 million....I am not quite sure how you can make that number....

I am really enjoying Paradise Lost. I kind of wish it was not so detail orientated and more narrative like because the story and plot itself is very engaging, but we are definitely moving through it at a good pace. I like how more and more ex-angels are getting introduced, I that keeps happenning.

Reading #2

In the reading tonight and in class I found the part where Beelzebub sucked up to Satan very interesting. I was kind of confused about there relationship at first, but when Beelzebub started his speech "O Prince, O Chief" I started to see what he was to Satan. The seriousness of this address showed that their relationship is all about business, and also how servile B is to Satan. Even though B is inferior, some of his ideas were really good and his intelligence is probably why he is Satan's right hand man. When B suggests that they are still alive for a reason, and that God has a purpose for putting them in Hell, whether it is to suffer to be slaves. The way the speakers switch up a lot is what confuses me most about the poem, but once we get further into it I think it should be easier to follow.

The Voice of Reason

In our reading tonight, I found the conversation between Satan and Beelzebub to be very interesting. Disclaimer...I could have completely read this the wrong way. What it seemed like to me was that Satan kept going on and on about how the battle with God was not over and how the Rebel Angels can still defeat God because now that they have fought him once, they know His tactics.  After Satan has shared all of this information, Beelzebub seems to be the voice of reason.  He keeps saying that God is almighty,and he is also trying to figure out what they should do while they are in Hell because he is trying to indirectly make the point that they are not going to defeat God, so they should try to make a life for themselves in Hell.

Paradise Lost

I really like this book/poem so far. I think it is a cool perspective on a story that most of mankind knows from childhood. The only thing I wish was that there was a more defined set of rules for angels v. humans. Although speculation isn't necessarily a bad thing, I don't really like how everything we say is either a human rule applied to the angels or a hypothesis.

The Nature of Evil

Both of the villains we have studied so far have something interesting in common. When Iago's machinations are finally uncovered, we takes a vow of silence and basically disappears form the play. Similarly, when Satan completes his evil mission, he slinks into the bushes and vanishes. What does this say about the nature of evil? Does evil only exist so long as it has a purpose and then fades away?

Confusion

Throughout the poem Satan talks about Hell as a terrible, awful, bad place compared to Heaven. He keeps talking about "how far we've fallen" and how its such a shame that they're not in Heaven anymore. I don't understand how Satan can be happy with what he has done if he keeps complaining about his situation. I figured that because Satan is so evil that he would consider what we consider bad to be good. But strangely my opinion of Hell seems to be his opinion: bad.

Satan and his demons are aware that what they are doing is evil, they even call it evil. I would have thought that evil would become good and good would become evil.

I think Coach Crook, you said something about Hell not being the opposite of Heaven but an inverse of it? Is this what that means? Or is this just Satan knowing what is evil and liking it? Or if not liking it, at least tolerating it.

Satan's Power

Satan's last speech is to Eve, trying to convince her to eat the apple. His first speech was to Beelzebub trying to convince him to never return to God in Heaven. I think this just shows that the only real power that Satan has is his power of deceit and temptation which are both very powerful and very effective. While God has many more powers than Satan has, he doesn't appear to have, or just wouldn't ever use, the power of deceit.

Hell forever

As stated by the Dr. Faustus quotes and some of Paradise Lost, Hell exists everywhere that Heaven is not, and Hell is felt by all those that have been in Heaven once they are all out of Heaven. Does this apply to people who have never been in Heaven before? If so, how do they know what Heaven feels like to have a perspective of what Hell should feel like?

Battle in Heaven

A few days ago, Coach Crook summarized the "fight" in heaven, and how it wasn't technically a battle...so then how do we know that Mammon and Michael are such great warriors if they didn't technically fight?

Revelations

Okay, so I just realized this: the title "Paradise Lost" has a double meaning. It can refer to Satan being thrown out of heaven, and humans being thrown out of Eden. God kicks them out of both, so I guess he is kinda like the great evictor in the sky...

Crazy Capitalization

Has anyone else realized that Milton capitalizes practically every third word in the book? I understand capitalizing some words for emphasis, but I think he does so often that the impact tends to wear off. Why does Milton insist on going overboard with capitalization?

The Son of God

In the beginning, there was only God, who created all life, correct? If so, everything that God created would be, in essence, his (sorry, his/her/its) child. If this is true, how can "The Son of God" be more of God than Satan. They were both born from God, so they should both be God's sons, and there for equal, but clearly, it is not so. Does anyone have a solution to this conundrum?

Free Will

I talked to Coach Crook about a question that arose in class one day. Why doesn't God just kill off Satan if he knew that Satan was going to rebel against him? Since we have free will, we have the ability to choose between God and Satan. We are his children, and he wants us to have a good life. But, he can't force his love upon his children. Everyone has a choice. If one turns towards God, then that exemplifies God's glory, good triumphing over evil.

2nd in Command

I know this is a little late and not what we're reading right now.

Before Satan fell, he was the "right-hand man" to God. But once God created the Son of God, Jesus, the Messiah, ect, he was demoted to his "left-hand man." Once in Hell, Satan told Beezlebub that he was 2nd in command. Wouldn't you think that Satan would realize what a risk you run when naming someone your "right-hand man" or 2nd in command? He is his own case in point: when Satan was God's 2nd in command he began to feel that he was better than God and that his true deserved position was head honcho. Couldn't this same jealousy and resentment grow in Beezlebub? What is it with these powerful, smart people creating problems for themselves??

Democracy?

Today in class Coach Crook mentioned that the devil will create a fake democracy in hell. We also touched on the topic of how God gives everyone the choice to be good or to be evil. If God promotes free choice than why did he punish Satan for choosing to overthrow him? Is God really any more noble than Satan?

Hope in Hell

In Paradise Lost, John Milton describes hell as a place where "hope never comes," but later Satan says "we may with more successful hope resolve/ To wage by force or guile eternal Warr..." (66, 120-121). That seems contradictory to me. Does Milton mean to specify that "good" hope does not exist in hell? Then again, hell is supposed to be absolute torment, but it seems that the fallen angels take some sort of comfort in the fact that they will not repent but continue to rebel.

Jewish View on the Devil

So after our discussion in class today I started to wonder what the Jews believe about the devil. So after looking around chabad.org i came across some interesting points in this article: http://www.chabad.org/library/article_cdo/aid/1093498/jewish/Can-You-Sell-Your-Soul-to-the-Devil.htm

"we see that G‑d created an angel to play the role of provocateur; that he is a messenger of, and subservient to, G‑d. He was not a fallen angel or sent to Hell, where he began fighting G‑d; he was created to be Satan. Neither does Satan spend his days stoking the flames of hell with his pitchfork. He is a presence on earth with a mission: to provoke people to disobey G‑d's will."

"There is no power of evil independent of G‑d; otherwise this would imply a lack of G‑d's all-inclusive control and power. To quote the Book of Isaiah:

"…from the place where the sun rises until the place where it sets, there is nothing but Me. I am G‑d, there is nothing else. [I am He] Who forms light and creates darkness, Who makes peace and creates evil; I am G‑d Who makes all these."3

Obviously then, the satan is not an autonomous force who opposes G‑d and recruits people to his militia. Rather, the satan is a spiritual entity that is completely faithful to its maker"

We were discussing today in class that everything God creates is good. However, God was the creator of hell and of Satan. I think some of the points I pulled from the article help answer our questions.